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November 08, 2013

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How fortunate are the stations that operate in unrated markets, who don't have to play the Arbitron (now Nielsen) game and attempt to validate their usefulness to an advertiser based on, to quote Ben, "flawed methodology, laughably small sample sizes, and audience 'estimates'."

"Server-side data" may be attractive to marketers in that it gives them another way to cover their butts when the ads don't work (just as GRPs have done in the past). The real issue in accountability is what it's always been - not how many people are reached, but how effective are the messages that reach them? Traffic in stores, butts in seats, donations to the charity...these are the acid test of the value of any radio station, regardless of its distribution channel.

I like Pandora - for background music. It's a little like hitting "random play" on a CD changer. The quality and variety are superb. But if they start inserting ads, I'm likely to go back to CDs or MP3s for a purely musical environment.

However, like so many other folks, when I want *company* - local personalities, local culture, local news, weather, or whatever - local radio is still my first choice. Yours too?

Tom Imber


I find it amazing that the top dogs of the radio industry are attacking Pandora and the way they come up with their numbers. Did they forget how ridiculous and inaccurate Arbitron numbers were and still are? It is clear they are running scared. The advertising industry has moved a huge chunk of money from traditional radio to digital/streaming. Solid local radio with a great brand and programming will survey but it won't be broadcast from an antiquated tower. AM/FM is dead, not radio.

Tom Kay

Nearly since it was born, Pandora has been rejected by terrestrial radio as not being “real radio”. As recently as yesterday, Clear Channel’s CFO Rich Bressler once again poked Pandora as being “not even close to real radio.” Why, then, should anybody care what this ‘non-real radio’ entity (Pandora) claims with regard to audience numbers? It would be apparent that the afore-mentioned 26 year-old media buyers are perfectly content with data presented by Pandora, likely because they (or members of their social networks) may be users of this ‘new shiny object’. I suspect you are right when you claim there are Pandora advertisers who simply want to believe in its success…and so they do. How wonderful – and different - it might be for Rich Bressler if “real radio’s” advertisers did the same.

Ben Yuasa

No. No, No, No.

Two important things here: "Pandora: Time to step up and live by the standards of all other media."

The standards and methodology of the "other media" that you refer to are garbage. Flawed methodology, laughably small sample sizes, and audience "estimates." Present Arbitron's methodology to a 200-level statistics class and get laughed out of the room.

In contrast, Pandora uses server-side data. That means an exact measurement of how many listeners there are at any given time, where they are, what they are doing, and even who they are, demographically speaking.

I really think you're opening a "Pandora's Box" here. If you successfully persuade/annoy Pandora to bend their standards of measurement to meet old radio's inferior methodology--even as an experiment--you may not like what you find. You probably won't like what you find.

This old radio lobby is poking a hornet's nest here, and it's full of 26-year-old media buyers that live on the coasts and have no use for terrestrial radio. Proceed with caution.

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